Arek'Jaalan Mailing List W4: Project Macaper's Eye (Overview Document)
| From | Myxx |
| Subject | Project Macaper's Eye (Overview Document) |
| Date | 113.07.30 21:16 |
| Content | It is time that I formally introduce this effort into public light. Many already know of it as the research into sleeper tech inside the Aurora Ominae superweapon.
I had at first intended to take my time and wait for two blueprint copies to surface and make their way to me because firstly, I don't feel its an inititive that needs to be taken in a rushed manner and secondly, I didn't feel as if there was a need to ask for donations of BPOS or functioning weapons. I did not initially accept any donations because it hadn't been worked out if any of it would ever be returned to their initial owners. To that end, regardless of my desire to take things slowly, two BPOs have been aquired by the aquisitions team. Thanks must be given to them, and specifically Pilot Antiquarian. One blueprint original will be making its way to Dr. Tukoss within the next few days under secure and anonymous transportation. Transportation is being provided by a third party unrelated to any political or military faction in new eden. They have specific, and intracate knowledge of transporting goods worth multipile billions of isk each day. The second will be taken to a remote destination for three or so weeks, give or take five days to be looked over and improved for efficency in manufacturing processes. Afterwards, the second will be used in the manufacturing process to create a functioning Aurora Ominae superweapon. The Aurora Ominae will then be delivered, again anonymously and securely to Dr. Tukoss for analysis alongside the blueprint regarding sleeper technology, its functions inside the weapon and other application possibilities.
My initial thoughts are that it would be nice to know the origin of the technology that is reverse engineered. That is, what aspects of its design come from the sleepers? On a technical and technological level it would be very interesting, I think at least, to know how sleeper tech that pre-dates the wormholes by a good many years made its way into a rather common weapon of mass destruction. |
| From | Myyona |
| Subject | Project Macaper's Eye (Overview Document) |
| Date | 113.07.30 21:47 |
| Content | Sorry, but the content of this document is far from acceptable for me.
I am very concerned about just how much Dr. Tukoss has been involved in encouraging a project that essentially means construction of a weapon of massive mass destruction on such weak scientific premises; if you want to study the design of the Aurora Ominae do it from the blueprints, that is what they are made for. I need much greater scientific justifications for the need to actually construct one, and even then I would have my doubts about participating in the affair. If there ever had been a need for the Ethical Committee to take a stance I would say it would be now. I do not support that any and all kind of research is justifiable “because of Sleeper”. In this case I am not even seeing the research; it looks more like simple arms dealing with a cover. Regards |
| From | Unit XS365BT |
| Subject | Project Macaper's Eye (Overview Document) |
| Date | 113.07.30 22:03 |
| Content | Pilot. The item in question can only be utilised when fitted to a vessel that cannot be piloted within high security space.
Considering the fact that pilot Tukoss is based within Matari High security space, your fears that such a weapon will be used are utterly unfounded. Secondly, blueprints do not allow physical examination of a device. Physical examination of a functional device will in general produce a much wider set of results, as parts of the device can be purposefully offlined or even removed to allow for theoretical study to become practical examination. Without practical application of scientific theory, the theory will remain just that. This project is valid in our eyes, and may be of use to the Arek'Jaalan project as a whole, as it is reportedly the first instance of reverse engineering of Sleeper technologies by any of the 4 empires. and may therefore reveal more detail concerning the technologies in question. We Return. |
| From | Telecom Tina |
| Subject | Project Macaper's Eye (Overview Document) |
| Date | 113.07.30 22:50 |
| Content | Concerning the acquisition and construction of the Aurora Ominae, the Ethics Committee has not intervened because the research is not unethical.
It has been already stated that the device is entirely useless unless fitted to an Erebus class Titan. It poses no danger as it is. Furthermore, these Doomsday Devices are already in widespread use in the lawless regions of space One might be able to argue that the invention of such a device was unethical. But that years ago and far outside of our control. Like it or not, the device already exists, and not learning what we can from it would be foolish. - Tina |
| From | Myxx |
| Subject | Project Macaper's Eye (Overview Document) |
| Date | 113.07.30 22:52 |
| Content | public thread so rampant rumormongering with completely unfounded fears is elsewhere
http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1559225 |
| From | Myyona |
| Subject | Project Macaper's Eye (Overview Document) |
| Date | 113.07.30 23:59 |
| Content | That capsuleers construct weapons of mass destruction to cause the death of thousands for little monetary gain is not an argument to support constructing another weapon; it is an argument against it. No Titans in high sec space, really. Have you been in Luminaire lately?
No matter, the more pressing issue here is; what is the point of the project? Playing around with the thing and hope that it does not blow up? Having a schematic that perfectly explain in detail how to construct a functional device, building the device and then dismantling it, hoping something that was not on the schematic will appear? Where should it come from? You are making no preliminary studies or theories before concluding you definitely need to construct a weapon of mass destruction to get anywhere. That makes the motivations behind the project very suspicious. Do you even know what kind of Sleeper technology is at question here? The old stuff in Ani perhaps? Worst part of it is that the stated final goal seems to be just to hand it over to Dr. Tukoss with no explanation why he would want one. If Dr. Tukoss’ final goal is to obtain a weapon of mass destruction I would be very worried that this whole research project is a farce. A cover-up, so to say. And if the weapon is not for him, then who? -M |
| From | Unit XS365BT |
| Subject | Project Macaper's Eye (Overview Document) |
| Date | 113.07.31 00:29 |
| Content | The vessel in Luminaire is not capsuleer controlled. Pilot Tukoss is a capsuleer. As is every participant in this project. The point of this project is research into sleepers, ancient races, AND THE TECHNOLOGIES USED BY THEM.> You are just creating unfounded suspicions. if all you wish to do is throw conspiracy theories into the air, go to IGS and do so there. This is a scientific project. We Return. |
| From | [Eveneth (Character) |
| Subject | Project Macaper's Eye (Overview Document) |
| Date | 113.07.31 00:58 |
| Content | ...and as a scientific project, some precautions must be taken. I am fully on the side of pushing this forward; however, as a fellow scientist (real life Theoretical Astrophysicist and Aerospace Engineer) I feel obligated to point out a few things. The only reason the Aurora Oinae superweapon does not function in High Security space is because (presently) it must be fitted to an Erebus-class Titan, and titans are not allowed in high sec. The concern is this: given the apparent resources of Mr. Tukoss, there is no reason to assume he wouldn't be capable of constructing a power source for the weapon, thus allowing it to be operated in high sec. That is, the are no preventative measures in place to prohibit the use of superweapons (similar to a cyno jammer for cap vessels) within Empire regions. I would suggest, that while observing the operation of a fully functioning sleeper-based device holds high merit for scientific study, I must stress that the weapon be observed in low or null sec space...or even better, build a device to power it, then take it into a wormhole!
If the device is only being constructed in high sec and not being powered in any shape, way, or form, then by all means do it in high sec. Again, as a fellow scientist, I fully support this endeavor, but precautions must be taken to ensure the safety of billions. |
| From | Unit XS365BT |
| Subject | Project Macaper's Eye (Overview Document) |
| Date | 113.07.31 01:05 |
| Content | Pilot. CONCORD systems within high security space disallow activation of certain modules. Doomsday Devices are among these modules. Also Cyno field launchers, Fighters, Fighter bombers, and many other capital vessel requirements are similarly jammed. This has been the case within High Security space since before the legislation change that stopped the production of capital class vessels within high security space. and prior to the change from AoE Doomsday Devices to single target ones. We hope that this data helps to calm your fears. We Return |
| From | Myxx |
| Subject | Project Macaper's Eye (Overview Document) |
| Date | 113.07.31 01:30 |
| Content | I pondered and even considered having a friend of mine outright demonstrate the weapon in nullsec. And then we both agreed at the same instant it was out of the question because of security concerns.
The Aurora Ominae cannot fire within high security space. I don't think Dr. Tukoss would construct a power source capable of it. |
| From | Jinx |
| Subject | Project Macaper's Eye |
| Date | 113.07.31 03:00 |
| Content | To assuage fears both outside and within the project, perhaps it would be prudent to delay this particular research for now. I am sure there are other artifacts and data we could collect from the w-space ruins that would provide valuable insights into both the Sleeper and Talocan technology without having to build battleship-sized disintegration rays. Mabye the question we should seek to answer is why the Sleepers believed they needed such a weapon in the first place.
After we learn more of these people and make a few breakthroughs concerning thier technology and culture, then perhaps the community at large will be more at ease with our persuit of this particular item. |
| From | Wyke Mossari |
| Subject | Project Macaper's Eye (Overview Document) |
| Date | 113.07.31 08:05 |
| Content | I find the suggestion that this weapon could be modified in such a matter that it could be fitted to a sub-capital vessel for use in High-Sec space extremely dubious to the point that it appears to be a case of spreading unnecessary fear uncertainty and doubt for ulterior motives.
This class of weapons are only fitted to Titan class vessels because of the infrastructure requirements they demand. While not an expert in capital class vessels I am expert in the construction of all sub-capital vessels. It is simple infeasible to consider fitting this class of weapons to any current sub-capital vessel. The power grid requirements alone are several orders of magnitude above what is possible to achieve in even the most powerful examples of the Battleship class . It is dubious that it will ever be possible without a step change in reactor technology and will likely remain infeasible for a indefinitely. While not entire familiar with the objective of this project I consider the objections to be an unwarranted attack on the academic freedom central at the very core of the AJ programme. Any attack on academic freedom is an attack on AJ as a whole. |
| From | Vanneth |
| Subject | Project Macaper's Eye |
| Date | 113.07.31 08:34 |
| Content | Jinx's suggestion is indeed a prudent one, keeping in mind that the item is still of interest and to be studied eventually. The community is already wary of Arek'Jaalan, and we are facing broad condemnation from many fronts. We need to tread carefully if we are to succeed. Holding aloft a devastating weapon, whether or not it can be fired, is a dangerous early move to make.
It may also have been less than ideal to name this particular project after a madwoman that was known for doomsaying and ranting about the apocalypse. Anslo may have something to say on the matter, considering the relevance of the stir to MRID. -Professor Vanneth Deckard |
| From | Anneka Tong |
| Subject | Project Macaper's Eye - criticism |
| Date | 113.07.31 08:42 |
| Content | The proposal is vague and undefined, and there are several concerns about the validity of any results, the safety of conducting experiments, and the process by which this proposal was approved.
A better proposal would have been formatted along the lines of: Introduction: Publicly available knowledge about practical application of Sleeper technologies is limited. The Project seeks to improve this situation through careful examination of a known item that incorporates Sleeper technology. The item concerned is a Federation Navy designed superweapon, routinely fitted to Titan class vessels. Research Aims for this Project are: Literature Review: An overview of the relevant publications relating to Sleeper technologies (probably rather slim) Methodology: A description of what is going to be done, and why. Data Assessment: A description of how the results will be analysed. Timeframe: An overview of various project milestones Budget: What resources (Materials and personnel) would be necessary.
Other concerns would be the validity of results. Dissecting the device and the blueprint would reveal the mechanisms it employs, but how is it that the Sleeper technologies will be recognisable, compared to the other Federation Navy proprietary technologies employed in the device? I.e. A computer hardware module on the device, is that a native Federation design, or a Sleeper derived one? Can you point at any particular piece and say "This is not a thing that has been developed in New Eden" ? The safety of the project is also a concern. The device is a large-scale antimatter projector, and as such, should be handled with a degree of care aboard the Eram station where Dr. Tukoss is located. A failure of the device under testing would pose a significant risk to the station. What procedures and protocols are in place to mitigate this? What Risk Assessments have been conducted? There would be further political objections from the station owners and the Republic. These need to be addressed. So, there are several concerns about the nature of the project, and these have to be addressed. |
| From | Myxx |
| Subject | Project Macaper's Eye |
| Date | 113.07.31 13:29 |
| Content | No delay will be taken. Everyone is making quite a big deal over such a small theoretical problem that isn't likely to come to pass. I refuse to give into people who would like to see the downfall of an educational research project.. |
| From | Jinx |
| Subject | Project Macaper's Eye |
| Date | 113.07.31 14:48 |
| Content | You are, of course, free to pursue any research that you wish. I do hope that my concerns are baseless and your endevors are safe and insightful. |
