Edge cases and other fitting curios - 28th Feb 2015

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ISD IonCharge > Today we will be looking at some non-standard setups that you may or may not ever see being used.
ISD IonCharge > If you want to take a look at the numbers for yourself as we go, you may find it useful to have a fitting simulator open - Pyfa and EFT are the most popular; you can easily find them via a search engine such as google.
ISD IonCharge > First off, we'll start with a specific module, which has given rise to many interesting, unique even, setups; X-Large Ancillary Shield Booster
Trujin Lyangod > praise google D:
Trujin Lyangod > *bows*
Jupiter Eve > /emote bows
ISD IonCharge > Whereas previously, ships had to have not only sufficient powergrid and CPU to fit and use modules, they also needed cap for active defences - the Ancillary Shield Booster, or ASB, changed that.
ISD IonCharge > Suddenly, you have a module offering battleship-level shield restoration to anything that can squeeze it in - anything in this case including many cruisers.
ISD IonCharge > Initially it was immediately popular on certain ships with bonuses to shield boosting, such as the Minmatar commandships, as well as heavy assault cruisers like the Vagabond, where the tank it provided, coupled with
ISD IonCharge > the ship's mobility, allowed it to survive far better than it previously could.
ISD IonCharge > Then, as more people got used to the idea of fitting cap-free tank to their ships, it started seeing some rather interesting diversification.
ISD IonCharge > One such example is on the Oneiros logistic cruiser - ostensibly an armor-tanking ship, and generally recommended to fit the aforementioned armor tank when fielded in any quantity, so that they can repair each other effectively.
ISD IonCharge > However, if you are running a small gang and just need one logistic ship, in this case it was found that an XL-ASB setup is actually very effective; granting the logistics ship a good ~700 dps burst tank, without the traditional drawbacks of
ISD IonCharge > shield tanking such as increased signature radius.
ISD IonCharge > Coupled with an afterburner, and the ship's already small signature, this gives it a great deal of survivability indeed, in small scale skirmish scenarios; this was used a fair bit in alliance tournament matches, where the number of ships is limited.
ISD IonCharge > Another ship which was formerly passively tanked until the debut of the ASB is the Onyx heavy interdictor; unlike most cruiser-sized hulls, the Onyx can actually fit dual XL-ASBs while still fitting a full rack of weapons, thanks to the
ISD IonCharge > also relatively-new rapid light missile launchers, which use a comparatively small amount of fitting resources.
ISD IonCharge > This creates a rather unique cruiser, which can tank thousands of dps, but is also able to effectively apply damage, especially to smaller targets like frigates; this is especially important due to HICs' new roles post-thera.
ISD IonCharge > Once Caroline's star exploded, and Thera opened up, a number of new wormholes started appearing - small wormholes, able to fit only frigate-sized hulls, in normal circumstances.
ISD IonCharge > However, heavy interdiction cruisers, with their warp disruption field generator active, receive a significant mass reduction, allowing them to also enter these frigate-sized wormholes.
ISD IonCharge > So, by using a ship with a very strong tank, and good damage application against small targets, in an environment where only small targets are possible (along with other HICs of course) you can gain a decisive upper hand in a fight.
ISD IonCharge > Any questions so far?
Jupiter Eve > nope
ISD IonCharge > Don't be shy to interject if you wish further info on anything I'm talking about.
Sangoro > interesting stuff
Trujin Lyangod > disruptionfeilds lower mass? o.o
Manfred Twilight > * can you link an example?
ISD IonCharge > Example of what?
Manfred Twilight > ASB fitted onxy for instance..
Manfred Twilight > * onyx lol..
ISD IonCharge > ASB Onyx that is a rough starting point; you will need to adjust the fit for your skills and implants; quite a lot of variation is possible.
Manfred Twilight > tks..
Zacky Snowfox > ISD IonCharge I assume as you mentioned it it is "legal" to bring in a cruiser to a "frigate-size" region? Or is this considered exploiting / bug-using?
Jupiter Eve > fit is pretty good
ISD IonCharge > HICs entering frigate wormholes using their field generator's bonus is intended, and was specifically mentioned by the devs at the time those wormholes were released.
Zacky Snowfox > nice and thanks for answering :)
ISD IonCharge > Another example of a ship which can enter a wormhole that normally prevents its size hull, is the Nestor battleship, whose mass is low for a battleship, allowing it to enter class 1 wormhole space, normally impossible for BS hulls.
Zacky Snowfox > wow
ISD IonCharge > Back on the topic of ASBs - there is one ship class, indeed one ship, which takes advantage of their properties perhaps better than anything else - the Golem marauder.
Jupiter Eve > a nestor has less mass than a regular bs?
ISD IonCharge > Yes, significantly so; the nestor is 20mil compared to most battleships in the 80-100mil range.
ISD IonCharge > 20mil kg that is.
ISD IonCharge > So, the Golem, receives not only a bonus to shield booster amount, from its traits, but is also able to use the Bastion Module I module, further increasing its tank.
ISD IonCharge > However, it also has a large amount of fitting capacity; all of this ties together to make it one of the only ships in the game capable of running a triple-XL-ASB setup.
ISD IonCharge > As with all setups covered here today, this is going to be fairly edge-case.
Slow Ghost > what about the vargyr? do you know offhand if it can fit triple ASB?
ISD IonCharge > However, it is one of the most powerful tanks that you can fit on a sub-capital ship, with the specific added bonus of using absolutely zero capacitor, which is generally the marauder's greatest weakness when in bastion.
ISD IonCharge > The Vargur can also do it, but due to its slot layout and other stats, the tank it can achieve is significantly lower than the golem.
Slow Ghost > ok thanks
ISD IonCharge > Triple ASB Golem If we take a look at exactly how this all fits together,
ISD IonCharge > It's a combination of multiple factors.- no cap usage on the ASB- high base fitting capacity- long-range damage projection from the launchers
ISD IonCharge > The first point is important because it allows the setup to use solidifier rigs as shown; these increase the cycle speed of the shield booster, resulting in far higher tank.
ISD IonCharge > Normally a ship would not be able to sustain this, if the tank required capacitor, hence the benefit of the ASB.
Sangoro > ISD IonCharge is the ASB golem well used in fleet battles ?
ISD IonCharge > Now, on this kind of setup, you would basically only run one of the ASBs at a time - they will run out of charges very quickly, in about 28 seconds per module.
ISD IonCharge > This allows one to be running while the other is on reload cycle, which takes 60 seconds.
ISD IonCharge > It might not seem like you'll get an awful lot of tank out of a single ASB, but in this case, using only T2 fittings as shown, you get about 4000 dps tank, per ASB.
ISD IonCharge > That means you can either be running a constant 4000 DPS tank, or you can run a 12000 dps burst tank then suffer a long reload.
ISD IonCharge > Sangoro, in fleet battles marauders are rarely used, due to the fact that they are quite expensive and no amount of tank will save you from a fleet's dps when they call a primary target.
ISD IonCharge > Any othe questions on what's been said so far?
ISD IonCharge > other*
Manfred Twilight > nope..
Jupiter Eve > not really
hilo one > golem has a hugh cargo bay hold, wow nice, can i solo in low sec with this? bad idea?
Zacky Snowfox > what would be a good scenario to use the Triple ASB Golem?
Slow Ghost > whats a standard tank on a golem able to withstand? for comparison
ISD IonCharge > I would not recommend using an expensive ship for pvp if you are not skilled with using it.
Jupiter Eve > hilo one bad idea prob cuz in low sec a golem seems to be a big target
Jupiter Eve > very expensive
ISD IonCharge > Slow: a standard cap-reliant golem with an XL SB would tank around 8000 DPS.
ISD IonCharge > With a T2 fitting that is.
hilo one > hold alot cap charges.. hold for while
Jak Savage > question how do the booster charges affect the ancillary booster?
ISD IonCharge > However, as soon as you run into some energy neuts, that tank will drop to zero, whereas the ASB setup keeps going.
ISD IonCharge > Jak: the module fits 9 navy cap boosters, and 1 is used each cycle; when one is used, the module takes no cap at all.
Jupiter Eve > Jak Savage they take the booster charges
Jak Savage > ahh i see thx
ISD IonCharge > Basically, you are burning charges for cap-free tank, with the downside of a long reload cycle; stacking multiple ASBs allows you to bypass the reload effectively, by staggering which module is active and which is reloading.
Jak Savage > ok there powering it not suplying actual boosting
ISD IonCharge > Now, moving on from that, the next ship we're going to look at is a rather old setup which has been used for many years, albeit not very frequently; however due to the recent overhauling of the class, it's worth a revisit.
ISD IonCharge > Recon ships, specifically combat recons, now possess the unique characteristic of being invisible to directional scanners.
ISD IonCharge > While recons are known for projecting electronic warfare across fairly large ranges, this doesn't apply to all of their modules.
ISD IonCharge > For example, the Rapier's bonus to stasis web range only puts it to about 40km by default (using expensive faction fittings and other bonuses can significantly extend that).
ISD IonCharge > However, the one we're looking at today is the Curse specifically.
ISD IonCharge > The Curse is generally universally agreed to be one of those ships you just don't want to run into - using a full rack of medium energy neutralizers, it can effectively shut down the capacitor of any subcapital ship, going so far as to
ISD IonCharge > out-neut a battleship running dual heavy capacitor boosters.
ISD IonCharge > So, certainly a scary ship to face.
ISD IonCharge > There is however a second, very specific setup which is sometimes used on it - centred around a heavy energy neutralizer.
ISD IonCharge > Although the ship's base powergrid, only 900, would not suggest you could build an effective setup centred around a 2000-powergrid, battleship module, as it turns out, this is not the case.
ISD IonCharge > Large Neut Curse If we take a look at this example setup here;
ISD IonCharge > What this gives you, is a single neut (other high slots completely optional), which can reach out to just under 90km, and remove 1200 capacitor per cycle.
Manfred Twilight > * it could help if you could link an example of these fits as it was only when using EFT I figured out that it was the rig slots that helped out with being able to fit everything on the Onyx...
Manfred Twilight > * sry.. beat me too it :)
ISD IonCharge > While this is fairly low neuting because of the long cycle time, this sort of setup has a very specific usage - a 90km heavy neut allows it to reach out to logistics ships, which usually sit around 70km from a fight, and shut them down completely,
ISD IonCharge > which can be devastating to a fleet that is relying on logistics for their tanking.
ISD IonCharge > If you do not have such a tool at your disposal, you are forced to either fight the enemy fleet while they are being repaired, or burn towards their logis while being shot, and then have them scatter before you get in range; a horrible way to engage a
ISD IonCharge > fight regardless.
ISD IonCharge > However, bring along a few long-range heavy neut curses, and suddenly their logistics have no cap and can't sustain their fleet.
ISD IonCharge > An edge case to be sure, but then, that is what this whole seminar is all about.
ISD IonCharge > Any questions so far?
Jupiter Eve > nope
Manfred Twilight > with the rig slots.. is it the m3ed ancillary that allow it to have sufficient cap overall?
ISD IonCharge > The ancillary coupled with the reactor controls give it enough powergrid to fit the heavy neut and still have some space for the rest of its modules.
ISD IonCharge > Again, all of the fits that I'm linking are just vague examples, starting points for you to look at and work out better ones.
Manfred Twilight > k.. tks..
ISD IonCharge > Now, we'll look at something rather different.
ISD IonCharge > But before we do, a quick word on expected stats of a ship (this is very important to know when entering into a fight).
ISD IonCharge > How much EHP would you say a frigate typically is going to have?
ISD IonCharge > It will range from anywhere in the 1-2000 range, to 25-30k, depending on the hull and fittings; and significantly more with T2 implants and bonuses.
Jupiter Eve > lees than a cruiser?
ISD IonCharge > Similarly, for a cruiser you will expect the range to be from "low" to say the 50k mark; a few specialised ones, such as the Augoror Navy Issue can reach significantly higher numbers thanks to their bonuses, as can T2 and especially T3 ships.
ISD IonCharge > But, in any case, looking at a ship's hull you will have a certain expectation of its capabilities, simply because of what it can fit and what its base stats and traits are.
ISD IonCharge > A HAC (heavy assault cruiser) for example, is expected to have damage output in the 300-800 range, depending on if it's fit for short or long range combat, and 20-50k hitpoints; perhaps a bit more if it's going for all-out tank, such as on a Devoter.
ISD IonCharge > The reason I mention this is, while you can expect certain ship classes to perform in certain ways, there are usually a few that break the mould; we'll look at one such case now.
ISD IonCharge > Stealth bombers, as most will know, are a frigate class designed to use battleship-sized weapons; this gives them damage output far above their size class, though they can have trouble applying that damage to small targets.
ISD IonCharge > While each race has a stealth bomber, there are essentially two different slot layouts; all share 5 high slots, but the mids/lows are either 4/2 or 3/3.
ISD IonCharge > Higher mids and fewer lows allow for either greater tank, or greater electronic warfare; more low slots allows for more damage output.
ISD IonCharge > Several expansions ago, a new class of weapon was added; these are a special variant of T2 weapons, called Polarized weapons; the stealth bomber is in a unique position to make use of them.
ISD IonCharge > Polarized Torps is an example of the sort of setup you may consider.
ISD IonCharge > Polarized launchers have fallen in price significantly since their initial launch; you can now get that complete fit for the region of 150 million ISK; while this may be expensive for a frigate with next to no tank, the damage output it can produce
ISD IonCharge > is enough to justify it; with good skills, it pushes out nearly 1100 dps on overheated launchers.
ISD IonCharge > However, polarized weapons come with the major drawback of irreversibly setting the ship's resistances to zero; in this case we consider using shield extenders to give a little bit of HP; it won't save you from any kind of concentrated attack, by
ISD IonCharge > any ship, but it will be enough to for example allow you to warp yourself out if you pick up some aggression from stray drones.
Slow Ghost > i saw chance ravinne fit a bomber like that on his youtube show
Jupiter Eve > Slow Ghost same
Jupiter Eve > a nemisis
Slow Ghost > yeah
ISD IonCharge > The target painter helps apply dps from the torps, and 3 ballistic controls give maximal damage output.
ISD IonCharge > Alternatively you may want to use sensor dampening to prevent the target from locking you at all.
ISD IonCharge > The other ships now popular for polarized wepaons, are the Talos and Vindicator, both of which make use of neutron blaster cannons to give unprecedented damage output for their classes; of course, this comes with high risk, but they do see
ISD IonCharge > usage on the server, especially when it comes to shooting stationary structures, such as sovereignty-related structures, or the station in incursions.
ISD IonCharge > Many vindicators partaking in said incursions will use mobile depots to refit to polarized guns to help complete the site faster once the NPCs are dead, reducing time spend and therefore increasing ISK per hour gained.
ISD IonCharge > Any questions so far?
Jupiter Eve > polorized weapons do more dmg or dps than regular launchers or so?
ISD IonCharge > Polarized weapons give about 25% higher dps, but set the ship's resistances to zero.
ISD IonCharge > They also have lower fitting requirements and high ammo capacity compared to T2 versions of the weapons, and yes they can use T2 ammo.
Jupiter Eve > seems deadly
Slow Ghost > do people tend to try to buffer tank or rep when using polarized weapons or just forget tank altogether?
ISD IonCharge > Generally you don't try to tank polarized ships; some HP buffer can be used, especially on battleships, but if you're choosing to go polarized, you won't live long in a fight; so either you do excessive dps and kill the target very fast,
ISD IonCharge > or you simply try not to be in a situation where you'll be shot while using them.
Slow Ghost > ah ok
ISD IonCharge > OK, so now we look at one final type of setup that is rarely used but still rather interesting - the "go-really-fast-in-a-straight-line" setup.
Trujin Lyangod > *excited*
ISD IonCharge > The question has been asked many times, just how fast can you make a ship go without warping or bumping? As in, under its own propulsion.
Jupiter Eve > /emote pays real close attention
Milla Millenium > Bet that's not going to be a Minmatar boat ...
ISD IonCharge > Many years ago, around the turn of the decade, speed was overhauled and vastly reduced; previously ships could go very very fast indeed, but this was resulting in poor gameplay, so speed was overhauled, to prevent things like 20km/s frigates running
ISD IonCharge > around the place.
Jupiter Eve > lol
Manfred Twilight > * damn..
Jupiter Eve > dam
ISD IonCharge > So, now, in the current version of the game, how fast do you think a ship could go under its own propulsion?
ISD IonCharge > 5km/s? 10? throw out some numbers!
Manfred Twilight > * without implants?
Milla Millenium > Around ... 4km/s
ISD IonCharge > With everything possible that contributes to speed.
Jupiter Eve > ISD IonCharge around 2 or 3
Reika Kirsi > 8km would be my guess
Elan Tetra > 10k with 10mn mwd on a frig
Jupiter Eve > fastest would prob be a fig going 5km/s
ISD IonCharge > You're all in not even the right ballpark.
Manfred Twilight > youtube video shows you can get arount 10-12km/s
Manfred Twilight > * non mwd..
Jupiter Eve > ISD IonCharge i dont go for very fast speed ok
Reika Kirsi > battleship mwd on a frigate?
ISD IonCharge > Let us start with the Claw, one of the fastest interceptors, which is one of the fastest ship types in the game.
Jupiter Eve > Reika Kirsi soundscrazy
Jupiter Eve > minmatar!?
Milla Millenium > Yay
ISD IonCharge > If we use the low slots for micro auxiliary power cores, and the rig slots for powergrid expansion also, you can fit a 10mn MWD to it.
ISD IonCharge > This alone gives a speed of 9,821m/s, or overheated, 14,432m/s.
Jupiter Eve > omg
ISD IonCharge > It would normally not have the capacitor to run this for any length of time, but a small capacitor booster lets it keep it going as long as required.
Reika Kirsi > vroom vroom
ISD IonCharge > However, this is only the beginning.
ISD IonCharge > Next we add skirmish warfare links, from a commandship such as the Claymore.
Jupiter Eve > ...
Milla Millenium > No one should go that fast in Minmatar stuff ;)
ISD IonCharge > This bumps the speed to 18.607m/s.
ISD IonCharge > Next we will add the T2 Snake implant set.
ISD IonCharge > This bumps the speed to 23,211m/s
Jupiter Eve > is this legit?
ISD IonCharge > Then, adding the slot-8 Zor's implant, and the Quafe Ultra booster, thigs brings the speed up to 25,550m/s.
ISD IonCharge > Then, if you think that's slow, we can find a Class-6 wormhole system, which has a +100% speed bonus; this brings the speed up to 51,101m/s.
Zacky Snowfox > and I was stoked about my 1100 m/s.....
Emmarenn > As long as you don't mind having to back and pick up pieces of your ship from the stress you'll be putting on it
Xiu Mieyli > omg
Manfred Twilight > :)
Jupiter Eve > hacks
ISD IonCharge > However, the Claw, while king of speed among interceptors, is not actually the fastest that's possible.
Jupiter Eve > is this even legal?
Milla Millenium > Did the primary buffer panel just fall off that ship, for no apparent reason?
ISD IonCharge > If we compare the Crusader to the Claw, notice that while the 'sader has a lower base speed, it has significantly more base powergrid.
ISD IonCharge > This allows us to save on a power core in one of the low slots, and fit an overdrive unit instead; this results in a higher overallspeed than the claw, though marginally - 26,158m/s, or 52,315m/s in a black hole.
ISD IonCharge > If you don't have warfare links at your disposal, and are in regular space, the Crusader will still clock in 20,277m/s without any external assistance whatsoever.
ISD IonCharge > While that is certainly impressive, and long held the claim to being the fastest, a new contender has recently arrived which shattered its record quite handily.
ISD IonCharge > Any guesses?
Emmarenn > 75km/s?
Xiu Mieyli > will all this info be available on that wiki page btw? cuz i gotta go and dont wanna miss out ;)
Elan Tetra > germer?
Zacky Snowfox > I'd say 80km/s
Manfred Twilight > * Concord dipolmatic shuttle? lol..
Reika Kirsi > If it's possible to get battleship mwd on a frig, thats gotta be fastest
ISD IonCharge > The brand new ship, the Svipul tactical destroyer.
ISD IonCharge > Because it has significantly higher base powergrid, we can give it enough PG from just rigs, allowing a full set of overdrives in the low slots.
ISD IonCharge > This leads to a speed of 17,863m/s from just fitting (compare to 14.4km/s on the Claw).
ISD IonCharge > Implants/boosters take this up to 24,511m/s when alone.
ISD IonCharge > Skirmish warfare link will then bump that to 31,580m/s, and the black hole doubles it to 63,161m/s.
Zacky Snowfox > lol....
ISD IonCharge > This is, to my knowledge, the fastest that a ship can currently go without warping/bumping.
Slow Ghost > im going to go get one after this...
Milla Millenium > o.0
ISD IonCharge > Of course, this kind of setup can really do pretty much nothing besides go fast in a straight line.
ISD IonCharge > However, that's not necessarily useless.
Manfred Twilight > * is looking around for somewhere even darker to hide in..
Milla Millenium > But ... but ... how do you stop it?
ISD IonCharge > Say an enemy sniper fleet warps in at range of say 200km.
ISD IonCharge > You can either launch probes and scan them and try to warp in like that.
Jupiter Eve > /emote is scared
ISD IonCharge > Or, you can fire up your Svipul and be on them in 10 seconds.
Zacky Snowfox > sounds like the american muscle car of Eve...
Zacky Snowfox > >.>
Slow Ghost > but can you stop on grid with them?
ISD IonCharge > Especially useful given the prevalence of hard-to-probe T3 sniper fleets around these days.
Manfred Twilight > basically that is faster than trying to scan them down..
ISD IonCharge > The Svipul with MWD going has an align time of only around 11 seconds, so the acceleration is quite good.
ISD IonCharge > In any case, that's the last of the edge cases I wanted to talk about today. If you have any questions about anything I've talked about, or any other fittings, be they esoteric or otherwise, please do ask now.
Slow Ghost > can you just put the requirements for a few of those speed fits in a short list please?
Slow Ghost > i dont think i followed the details fast enough
Jupiter Eve > you are a.... slow ghost
Jupiter Eve > :D
Slow Ghost > hush
Xiu Mieyli > will this session be made available like the other training sessions?
ISD IonCharge > 10mn MWD (preferably the COSMOS one, this has reduced powergrid usage, though is significantly more expensive); T2 snake implant set, slot-8 zor implant, quafe ultra; Skirmish link on a commandship; black hole class 6 system effect.
Slow Ghost > thanks
ISD IonCharge > Xiu, yes, it will be posted to the wiki, though probably tomorrow; getting a bit late tonight.
Manfred Twilight > * is there a session available on the various rigs used at all.. noticed that in at least one the rigs were what made the whole thing come together..
ISD IonCharge > OK, so let's discuss rigs.
Xiu Mieyli > ISD IonCharge great, thanks for doing this ;D
ISD IonCharge > Essentially, you will want to use rigs for one of 4 things:
ISD IonCharge > 1) to add some powergrid/cpu to allow you to fit out a fit; this is something you will have to see on a case-by-case basis.
ISD IonCharge > 2) to add HP to a ship; usually used for pvp; shield extender or armor trimark rigs are most popular, though resistance rigs are often used for 1 resist to round out a ship's defence profile.
ISD IonCharge > Active tanking rigs are used in a few setups specifcally built around them but active tanking is generally less popular than buffer in pvp, and in pve they're not really required.
ISD IonCharge > 3) mobility rigs - used usually on smaller ships (cruisers and down); polycarbons are most popular, as they give good bonuses to both speed and agility, though individual rigs for either can also be used in specific cases.
ISD IonCharge > mobility rigs are a good catch-all if you aren't sure what rigs a ship needs, as bsing a bit quicker can make a huge difference in a fight; just beware their armor penalty.
ISD IonCharge > 4) role-specific rigs. these are either dps rigs on ships focused on damage output (including turret range rigs etc), or microprofession rigs such as for exploration or salvage ships, or cargo rigs on transports, etc.
ISD IonCharge > However, on combat ships, don't be afraid to use rig slots simply for cpu/pg rigs; while it may seem like a waste, low slots which would otherwise take those modules can be used to fit damage mods etc, which can be much stronger.
ISD IonCharge > A T2 damage module gives pretty much the bonus of 2 damage rigs, so keep that in mind when allocating slots on a setup.
Jupiter Eve > ISD IonCharge for tanking what would be good for a caldari ship?
ISD IonCharge > Also, smaller ships, especially frigates, often simply don't have the slots to give up for fitting capacity, so rigs can be a big help for them.
ISD IonCharge > Jupiter, most Caldari ships prefer to tank shields; you'll usually only find armor tanks on their electronic warfare ships such as the blackbird / falcon / scorpion.
ISD IonCharge > Any other questions before we finish this up?
Jupiter Eve > ISD IonCharge well what i meant to say was what kind of tank if any would be good for pvp or should i just use a different race for those ships i might need
ISD IonCharge > What kind of tank, as in numerically? Or mechanically?
Manfred Twilight > * stops petting the fedo n puts it back into the cage..... :) says tks to ISD for informative session...
Jupiter Eve > mechanically
Jupiter Eve > yea thanks for the session i actually learned something
Jupiter Eve > like i never knew some of this stuff
Slow Ghost > yeah it was fun, interesting
Jupiter Eve > very
ISD IonCharge > Mechanically, most pvp ships will favour a buffer tank; active tanking is really only used in small scale fights, as anything larger than small scale, you will find your active tank quickly overwhelmed, and your HP will just drop all the faster.
hilo one > golem stuff was cool rest over my head:_)
ISD IonCharge > Whereas a buffer tank is essentially front-loading your HP.
ISD IonCharge > What you need to consider is how much damage you will be taking, or expect to be taking, and go from there.
Jupiter Eve > well lets say its for a duel
ISD IonCharge > For example, let's look at a ship which has 30k HP, and 500 active tank, versus one with 60k buffer and no active tank at all.
ISD IonCharge > If they are taking 1000 dps, they will both go down in 60 seconds.
ISD IonCharge > If they are taking less dps, the active tanked one will live longer, and vice versa.
Jupiter Eve > oh ok i see
ISD IonCharge > You can expect T1 cruisers to do 3-400 dps, T2 cruisers to do 5-600 dps, and so forth.
ISD IonCharge > Battlecruisers can do 1000+, frigates are usually in the 100-300 range.
ISD IonCharge > There is no correct answer; different setups will perform better or worse in different situations, so it's up to you to pick whichever one you think will do best in the situations you are likely to face.
Jupiter Eve > i see...
ISD IonCharge > Right well since that seems to be it, we'll end it here.
hilo one > good stuff, ISD IonCharge, took alot notes:) thank you.
Emmarenn > Thanks
ISD IonCharge > Thanks everyone for coming along and listtening, even if you didn't participate.
Kira Ornulf > Thanks
Manfred Twilight > tks for informative session....
Milla Millenium > Thank you for the info!
Slow Ghost > yep thanks
Rish Woo > thnaks
ISD IonCharge > The transcript of the session will definitely be on the seminars wiki page tomorrow, so you can point anyone who missed it to that page if they wish to review it.
Jupiter Eve > i hope we get more of these
Jupiter Eve > ISD IonCharge cool
Milla Millenium > Indeed
Jak Savage > Thanks ISD Ioncharge, was good info here.
ISD IonCharge > Fly safe. o7
Manfred Twilight > o7
Milla Millenium > o7
Jupiter Eve > lol ok
Jupiter Eve > o7